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Question: Why non-DD songs?


Fordpunk
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FNG here, really enjoying the site - it has added to my enjoyment of RS and learning already.

 

I couldn't find an answer to this question.  What is the purpose of non-DD songs?  I see many comments saying they 'prefer non-DD' or offering both options.

 

I understand that playing slow at 100% is really useful for learning, but I also like the DD option for learning new techniques/songs. 

 

What is the point of having non-DD?  Doesn't a DD song include everything the non-DD does and then some?  I can see if adding it is difficult, but why offer non or both versions - is there an advantage to the non-DD versions I am missing? 

 

PC user if that makes a difference.

 

Thanks in advance, I just want to make sure I am not missing something here that could be useful.

 

 

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You don't have to spend the few seconds to level it up to max. And you don't risk down leveling when you play.

 

And for us in the championship we can play non-DD songs on easy scoreattack and still get all the notes. (you can miss more without getting fails).

 

I have not used DD for over 1 year so i always pick non-DD songs when they are available.

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I was going to use DD for the first dlc's I made but it left out notes for some reason so I just never bothered to use it again after that. Also, to make it work properly for more complex songs is not that easy. Auto-generating DD is fast but isn't really DD as you should set up semi-identical phrases yourself if you want to make it work properly (if I remember correctly at least)

 

I also never use DD myself. I think it's useless to be honest. It doesn't add anything. Unless RS is the first time you ever played guitar there is really no reason to ever use it, and even then I don't think you should even use it. Riff Repeater is 100x better for learning a song. Even tough I dislike the long intro's riff repeater has to even start the phrases you want to learn, specially if you tone down the speed. So I barely even like RR for that sole reason. I can learn a song 10 times faster with just using tabblature.

 

I think they should really consider a new and better feature in the next installment of RS. Like showing the whole phrase at once like with tabblature instead of you having to wait for the notes, then completely get confused because you still suck at sightreading  :D and just waste time to repeat the whole thing without having learned a single thing. But that's just my experience with it

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On bass, I am decent enough to always play songs on full difficulty, so it's a pain to have to go into RR,select all sections and shove em to 100%.

 

I suck on guitar though so usually need to start on easy but I mainly play bass these days, I know where I belong :)

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For my part i only use DD, the engine now knows my average skill & put every new songs i play at least at 50% before i start.

 

Playing only with DD makes you familiar with the native game speed & allow you to match the notes/chords position easily.

 

I've set the note recognition to easy to speed up the levelling system.

 

When i play a hard song without DD, i Slow my play rhythm voluntary missing notes.

 

& the next time i play the song i can see my progress in %.

 

I play Rocksmith like i used to play Guitar Hero & Rockband (like a video game (i think it's more fun) & not like a song learning tool).

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*offtopic 'bout RR*

They could use some of GH practice techs, just let small amount of repeat notes and counter in with metronome sound(1 measure -1 beat) that would be useful to learn things I guess, I hate myself those "repeat previous phrase\section to practice new one" but it's logical that you need to start SLIGHTLY off the desired phrase, haha, hope ubi know about rr issues and how it should really be and beat GP repeat way to learn songs...

ty for reading

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I guess I've evolved to the point where on Official RS songs the first thing I do is hit riff repeater and take it to 100% difficulty and slow it down. I also take a peek at tabs when available and just learn it the slow way at 100%. So I don't even used DD and don;t miss it on the custom downloads. With that said by all means if it is helpful to you then use it when available.

 

I should note that I watch a play through on Youtube and don't attempt songs that are beyond my reach so the 100% slow down approach would not work on a song I have no business trying to play.

 

I do really wish you could custom select a section of a song to work on in riff repeater. If you only have issues with one little section you still have to play the entire phrase in RR. This is when I go to songster or tabs or something outside RS to work on one tiny section.

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My Youtube channel is basically a list of Rocksmith's easiest songs because those are the only ones I can play.  :P

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMV9RfoApHM5Zmi1CobqTJw

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DD can lose notes, my major gripe with DD is technique. I find I'll use the easiest fingering solution based on notes presented, which using DD often is opposite of what's required, I am holding myself back in a sense as I learn to finger the melody incorrectly, it works with DD but when more and more notes are revealed the flaw in the fingering method becomes apparent and by the time you work it from 0% to even say 60% you've spent all that effort learning to play it incorrectly.

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my major gripe with DD is technique. 

 

Don't know why I didn't mention this in my first reply, but this. If you are new to guitar playing you probably won't even notice this has a big influence on how you play. And in my opinion it's very counter productive realising you had the fingering wrong the entire time while you are leveling up the song.

 

 

 you only have issues with one little section you still have to play the entire phrase in RR. This is when I go to songster or tabs or something outside RS to work on one tiny section.

 

This too. RR is just such a waste of time most of the time it's ridiculous. 

 

@@chili_time also I'm not sure if you are aware, but you can get all the tabs from cdlc's with the toolkit. Very handy imo so I tought I should mention it.

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Thanks all for the replies, I think I have a handle on it now.  I'm a beginner level player so I'm mostly using DD, but I have noticed on the songs I know really well the note dropping is sort of annoying.  I usually just play through that part.  I can see how non DD can be useful now, and will probably grab both versions of some.  Thanks for telling me about the convert to tab tool as well - I suck at reading tab but I can slowly make it out and then practice the parts I need to learn.  Right now the biggest thing I like about DD is being able to 'try' songs and sort of get the groove down without having to worry about chords and chord changes I don't know anyway.  Appreciate the help.

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For my part i only use DD, the engine now knows my average skill & put every new songs i play at least at 50% before i start.

 

Playing only with DD makes you familiar with the native game speed & allow you to match the notes/chords position easily.

 

I've set the note recognition to easy to speed up the levelling system.

 

When i play a hard song without DD, i Slow my play rhythm voluntary missing notes.

 

& the next time i play the song i can see my progress in %.

 

I play Rocksmith like i used to play Guitar Hero & Rockband (like a video game (i think it's more fun) & not like a song learning tool).

 

Frack, How can you change note recognition ? try to find it and didn't.Thanks

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When I started with the game and started learning I would only DL DD customs because I actually needed the DD.

 

Now that I'm better, I still download DD wherever I can and just whack the difficulty up to full for each song, because I still like having the bars there to show progress better and the difference in difficulty between parts. I like it when creators give an option for DD, even if it's dodgy DDC.

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my major gripe with DD is technique. 

 

Don't know why I didn't mention this in my first reply, but this. If you are new to guitar playing you probably won't even notice this has a big influence on how you play. And in my opinion it's very counter productive realising you had the fingering wrong the entire time while you are leveling up the song.

 

 

 you only have issues with one little section you still have to play the entire phrase in RR. This is when I go to songster or tabs or something outside RS to work on one tiny section.

 

This too. RR is just such a waste of time most of the time it's ridiculous. 

 

@@chili_time also I'm not sure if you are aware, but you can get all the tabs from cdlc's with the toolkit. Very handy imo so I tought I should mention it.

 

Thanks! I remember seeing that once but had forgotten about it. I need to get on that this weekend. May as well use the tabs from RS. 

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My Youtube channel is basically a list of Rocksmith's easiest songs because those are the only ones I can play.  :P

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMV9RfoApHM5Zmi1CobqTJw

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For my part i only use DD, the engine now knows my average skill & put every new songs i play at least at 50% before i start.

 

Playing only with DD makes you familiar with the native game speed & allow you to match the notes/chords position easily.

 

I've set the note recognition to easy to speed up the levelling system.

 

When i play a hard song without DD, i Slow my play rhythm voluntary missing notes.

 

& the next time i play the song i can see my progress in %.

 

I play Rocksmith like i used to play Guitar Hero & Rockband (like a video game (i think it's more fun) & not like a song learning tool).

 

Frack, How can you change note recognition ? try to find it and didn't.Thanks

 

It's in riff repeater options (error tolerance), so it's supposed to only affect it but when i play a DD song (without entering riff repeater mode)

it seems easier to register the notes.

 

http://s30.postimg.org/e8w9g24cx/Rocksmith2014_2015_02_28_18_34_03_106.jpg

 

But If i play in SCORE ATTACK mode, every errors leads to a Cross.

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Thanks all for the replies, I think I have a handle on it now.  I'm a beginner level player so I'm mostly using DD, but I have noticed on the songs I know really well the note dropping is sort of annoying.  I usually just play through that part.  I can see how non DD can be useful now, and will probably grab both versions of some.  Thanks for telling me about the convert to tab tool as well - I suck at reading tab but I can slowly make it out and then practice the parts I need to learn.  Right now the biggest thing I like about DD is being able to 'try' songs and sort of get the groove down without having to worry about chords and chord changes I don't know anyway.  Appreciate the help.

You can do that anyways, crank your difficulty to 100, then just play everything on the downbeats don't worry about anything else. Essentially all DD is doing is giving you notes on the number count then throwing in the others.

 

Also in EOF you could open your CDLC song and just resave it without DD enabled, should work.

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not really, that's what DDC does! All official song have DD that is very well thought were you play accent and important note first wether or not they are on the downbeats then it fills up the void in a really smart way.

 

It's easy to put all of them in the same pack but they really aren't. And actually making DD as well as official does can easily take tens of hours for something that people just throw aside so it isn't worth doing by charters because nobody cares/notice (that's true for other more visible and easier stuff to make but i'm going out of topic with this).

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From a charter's point of view, making DD adds to development time - extra testing and messing about if you have to change some tabs or something.

 

Plus, adding DD is so easy now (you literally drag the .psarc into the toolkit) that anyone that wants it can add it themselves quite frankly :D

 

I love to play with no DD because I can handle most songs on guitar (those that I can't DD won't help anyway :lol: ) and it really goes back to how badly implemented it was in RS1.  I absolutely hated having to "perfect" a phrase to get it to level.  You could put 10 hours into a song you can play well just to level it to the max, and the RR with its long loading time for 1 bloomin section aagahagahgahag!!!

 

When I first tried an RS1 custom with no DD I was hooked, and haven't looked back.

 

One of my kids plays RS with DD and although it's fun, it's not teaching her properly.  Sure, she can play along to Justin Bieber without even trying, but I so want to take the guitar off her, put in the corner and say "learn some bloomin chords before anything else!!!".

 

But hey, it's 2016, no one is into hard work any more :D

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And yet i've learned guitar solely from Rocksmith and with DD i can easily argue that i'm doing a decent job at playing. Did it take me more time? i don't know! Was it fun? sure. Would have kept on going if DD wasn't available when i first picked the guitar? probably not or at least it would have made all the hard song a pass which would have been frustrating while DD allowed me to kept on going for hours everyday.

 

But after all of this i do a big distinction between DD in official song and DD in customs made by the DDC. The DDC is a simple algorithm that do a "not so bad" but far from perfect job which will lead to many issue when learning (but i could also argue that the charter that don't adapt fingering and such are doing more harm than a bad DD) while official song will have a lot more care put into them that help the learning process a lot for beginners. Sure at one point DD doesn't add much because you will play songs at 100% difficulty anyway, but that's also why Rocksmith 2014 simplify the access to the RR and the score attack system too.

 

If you are a decent player go into hard score attack, you might not finish songs but at least you will never have to worry about difficulty dropping or to put it at 100% the first time.

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For my part i only use DD, the engine now knows my average skill & put every new songs i play at least at 50% before i start.

 

Playing only with DD makes you familiar with the native game speed & allow you to match the notes/chords position easily.

 

I've set the note recognition to easy to speed up the levelling system.

 

When i play a hard song without DD, i Slow my play rhythm voluntary missing notes.

 

& the next time i play the song i can see my progress in %.

 

I play Rocksmith like i used to play Guitar Hero & Rockband (like a video game (i think it's more fun) & not like a song learning tool).

 

Frack, How can you change note recognition ? try to find it and didn't.Thanks

 

It's in riff repeater options (error tolerance), so it's supposed to only affect it but when i play a DD song (without entering riff repeater mode)

it seems easier to register the notes.

 

http://s30.postimg.org/e8w9g24cx/Rocksmith2014_2015_02_28_18_34_03_106.jpg

 

But If i play in SCORE ATTACK mode, every errors leads to a Cross.

 

 

Thanks Frack, will try it.

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One of my kids plays RS with DD and although it's fun, it's not teaching her properly. Sure, she can play along to Justin Bieber without even trying, but I so want to take the guitar off her, put in the corner and say "learn some bloomin chords before anything else!!!".

 

But hey, it's 2016, no one is into hard work any more :D

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I'm still a noob and I tried several songs last night that weren't DD and I ended up very disappointed. If I see a song I like I get it whether it's DD or not because some of them I have been able to play without DD. But it's always humbling when I start a song and it's not DD and within about 5 seconds I know I can't play it. I basically just do "play a song" because I love that so much. Maybe I should explore more of the game I guess. 

I'm confused on the DD though. If I play a song on DD and get 100% that means it's the full song correct? No note skipping or anything? Reading the replies above have left me confused on what DD is actually doing. 

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From the perspective of a charter I don't use Dynamic Difficulty because of what it does to the tabs.

99% of my customs are done by ear by myself. That means 1-3 days of tediously hard work of tabbing notes in place. Dynamic Difficulty from what I've seen will take those notes and spread them out across how ever many levels of difficulty the charter chooses to have and messes up the tabs in the final product.

 

For me that's asinine and a no bueno. In case of hard drive failure where I can't recover my files or something like that I have the final files saved in my Google Drive with the tabs exactly the way I wrote/left them, in case I needed to make changes to it.

 

That's why my customs do not and will not ever as long as I make them have dynamic difficulty. Plus I don't see the point seeing as you can slow down a section of a song and learn it the old fashioned way. 

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I'm still a noob and I tried several songs last night that weren't DD and I ended up very disappointed. If I see a song I like I get it whether it's DD or not because some of them I have been able to play without DD. But it's always humbling when I start a song and it's not DD and within about 5 seconds I know I can't play it. I basically just do "play a song" because I love that so much. Maybe I should explore more of the game I guess.

I'm confused on the DD though. If I play a song on DD and get 100% that means it's the full song correct? No note skipping or anything? Reading the replies above have left me confused on what DD is actually doing.

DD allows you change the level of difficulty of each section in the song. Each section is represented by the square blocks at the top of the screen. If you have DD set to 20% on each section and get 100% of the notes right you have only mastered 20% of that song. If you bump up a section to 100% it will become purple. If all sections are 100%, you are playing the entire song. Songs with no DD are at 100% difficulty no matter what.

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I'm still a noob and I tried several songs last night that weren't DD and I ended up very disappointed. If I see a song I like I get it whether it's DD or not because some of them I have been able to play without DD. But it's always humbling when I start a song and it's not DD and within about 5 seconds I know I can't play it. I basically just do "play a song" because I love that so much. Maybe I should explore more of the game I guess.

I'm confused on the DD though. If I play a song on DD and get 100% that means it's the full song correct? No note skipping or anything? Reading the replies above have left me confused on what DD is actually doing.

DD allows you change the level of difficulty of each section in the song. Each section is represented by the square blocks at the top of the screen. If you have DD set to 20% on each section and get 100% of the notes right you have only mastered 20% of that song. If you bump up a section to 100% it will become purple. If all sections are 100%, you are playing the entire song. Songs with no DD are at 100% difficulty no matter what.

 

Well ain't that a bummer. I had 4 songs at 100% that I thought I'd mastered. Bubble shattered  :unsure: When I arrange my list by mastery it says 100%. I guess I should've moused-over the boxes below that. I've dl'd so many songs that I keep jumping around to try new ones and haven't paid much attention to anything else. Oh well, this gives me something fun to do this weekend. By god, I will master them for real now!  :plus1:

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