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Discussion about extra class "Advanced"


Molice
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Additional class  

33 members have voted

  1. 1. Add 4th extra class "Advanced" ?

    • Yes
      26
    • No
      7
  2. 2. Change one week challenge, to two week challenge?

    • Yes
      13
    • No
      20


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And i have yet one idea. For those who want to learn a song very good in Master Mode. As temporarily replace "Advanced" class and altenative 2 weeks lerning.

We can get one random a song Int , what already was in WC, from second page "Song selection list" "Song played" and start challenge only in Master Mode for one week. But  not before last  2 the weeks. Example today random the number will be between 15-41.

 

upd. @@firekorn I agree Int a song more suitable for 2 week than a song in other class

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I haven't been around lately as much as I'd like.  I started a new job and the training has consumed most of my time.

 

I voted against the 2-week schedule.  Here's why: I don't see the competition about learning to master a song.  With one or two weeks, this is a lofty goal.  If you really care to master the song, you're going to do this with, or without, the competition.  Adding the extra week offers no benefit to those that want to master the song.  They already have the time. 

 

There are some that view it as a friendly competition and use that as motivation to play.  Increasing the duration to two weeks decreases the frequency of the competition.  These players lose something by the increase.

 

There are players like me.  I'm rather new to the guitar.  I didn't come to the challenge to learn.  I can do that with a variety of songs.  I came because it pushed me out of my comfort zone.  It introduced me to a new song each week that I wouldn't have looked at otherwise.  Doing so, it ended up making me work on techniques I hadn't even thought about.  It made me give new bands a chance.  And, it added to my music library.  Expanding to two weeks reduces these opportunities.

 

You can learn any song you'd like without holding the competition back. 

 

Realistically, the competition is many things to many different people.  There's only one group I can see that would benefit from extending the length, outside of organizers.  That group already can enjoy their desired goal.  If your intent is to master a song, that's a battle against yourself.  It is not a battle against others. 

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That's quite a persuasive post, @@natasftw .  Even though I personally like the depth that a 2-week challenge would allow for, the breadth and variety is probably going to be better with 1-week durations...  And that is probably more in line with the spirit and focus of the competition.  I find myself agreeing with you even though I just got my first win (MC Bass) on the strength of having 2 weeks to spend working on a song that was/is up my alley.  :)

 

 

The other issue of adding a 4th level I could still go either way on.  The new change I am seeing for this week where 3 songs have been selected for lead/rhythm/bass, but their assigned levels are different for lead/rhythm vs bass puts a whole new spin on that, I think.  I'll have to consider how that difference will change things.

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I think one real argument for the two week schedule is more competition by more competitors finding time to play - when we look at week 44 - mc jump into the fire that was held for two weeks there is an all time record in number of mc competitors - 13(!).

On the other hand i took two wins and a 2nd place in my entries - not that i'm not happy, but it might have partly to do with the # of competitors: 3, 2 and 1 (!) ....

 

 

As the vote for or against seems to be on the edge, and we do have lots of experience with the one week - why not give the 2 weeks a try for two times, and vote for or against in a months time when we know if its boring or good....

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I think one real argument for the two week schedule is more competition by more competitors finding time to play - when we look at week 44 - mc jump into the fire that was held for two weeks there is an all time record in number of mc competitors - 13(!).

On the other hand i took two wins and a 2nd place in my entries - not that i'm not happy, but it might have partly to do with the # of competitors: 3, 2 and 1 (!) ....

 

As the vote for or against seems to be on the edge, and we do have lots of experience with the one week - why not give the 2 weeks a try for two times, and vote for or against in a months time when we know if its boring or good....

 

Sorry but your argument is wrong the number of participant are a mix between int and MC player and there's less MC player for Jump Into the Fire Lead part than during the 43th week...

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I think one real argument for the two week schedule is more competition by more competitors finding time to play - when we look at week 44 - mc jump into the fire that was held for two weeks there is an all time record in number of mc competitors - 13(!).

On the other hand i took two wins and a 2nd place in my entries - not that i'm not happy, but it might have partly to do with the # of competitors: 3, 2 and 1 (!) ....

 

 

As the vote for or against seems to be on the edge, and we do have lots of experience with the one week - why not give the 2 weeks a try for two times, and vote for or against in a months time when we know if its boring or good....

Sorry but your argument is wrong the number of participant are a mix between int and MC player and there's less MC player for Jump Into the Fire Lead part than during the 43th week...

Damn, you are right, forgot about that!

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I like the idea of a 4th class between Int and MC

If 1 or 2 weeks its yes and no, everything about that was been said. It would be better for most of us with a 2 weeks intervall, so everyone have enough time for practice and improve. Otherwise music is a matter of taste, and sometimes the song choices are really not mine and so I'm happy to wait just one week for new songs. I also think it woul be a good thing to set the levels for bass arrangements separatly for the same songs like this week done.

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After reading through all the posts I clicked "no" for 2 week challenge, even though I am quite uncertain.

 

Nevertheless, I am sure about my "yes" vote for 4 classes!

 

It was mentioned that a problem might be the lack of entries... here is a thought about that:

 

I know that this idea was discussed before (and always dismissed for various reasons), but a global difficulty rating (included in the search engine) would really help the championship, I think.

Just like the "star rating" that exists on the song pages, all songs could have difficulty ratings that all users can fill in, seperated for each arrangement.

The classes should obviously be the same as used in the championship.

The difficulty class that is shown should be a representation of the average of the votes, after a minimum amount of e.g. 10 votes.

 

I believe that we are a strong community, where such a feature could actualy work.

 

With such a system implemented, every weeks entries could be drawn from the whole collection of classified songs. Since we cannot seperate Lead and Rhythm difficulty classes in the championship, with such a system the mods would have the possibility to make sure that the difficulties of Lead and Rhythm only differ by one class.

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As all see, "Advanced" class will appear in future. As long, it will depends from activity  participants.

I made new page in song selection list. From now all can adding a song as much as you want, until we obtain enough a songs for random selection for challenge. Then, in future, will rules - only 3 a songs from one participations. All can copy your last choiced a song from SSL to new page with filled  filed "difficult".

But. For challenge will selected a song only with all filled a columns "Difficulties", if there have empty difficult a song will ignored.

Difficult is the  number 1-10 (1 - easy) (10-hardcore)

Thus lets go fill the new  list. I hope on the next week we will have enough a songs for accepted 4th "Advanced" class. 

And remark, until list is empty you have big chance that your song will choiced. 

And yes, rhythm also will have separated  class and difficult.

Any suggestion and opinions is welcome.

 

Our common efforts made this WC the best in world :)

@@Azrael i think it unreal. As i see, no chance   got global rating difficult for all site. Developers dismissed it idea, so all have personal opinions, and rating will very subjective, depends - like or unlike  a song and other. With low activity on voting with "star" it is fail idea. There was wishes like Achievements for profile participants, even this in near future not appear. I see post, where admin wrote that now low activity donations, and no money for more actual improve for site. (We ask about it 3-4 times, and nope.) Quality Championship depends only from us.

 

Im very sorry, for those who disagree with 4th class. But most participants want it.

 

Upd. Add choiced a song even if you can not testing lead (rhythm) (an example if you Bass player), maybe anyone can help and filled empty difficult field .

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As all see, "Advanced" class will appear in future. As long, it will depends from activity  participants.

I made new page in song selection list. From now all can adding a song as much as you want, until we obtain enough a songs for random selection for challenge. Then, in future, will rules - only 3 a songs from one participations. All can copy your last choiced a song from SCL to new page with filled  filed "difficult".

But. For challenge will selected a song only with all filled a columns "Difficulties", if there have empty difficult a song will ignored.

Difficult is the  number 1-10 (1 - easy) (10-hardcore)

Thus lets go fill the new  list. I hope on the next week we will have enough a songs for accepted 4th "Advanced" class. 

And remark, until list is empty you have big chance that your song will choiced. 

And yes, rhythm also will have separated  class and difficult.

Any suggestion and opinions is welcome.

 

Our common efforts made this WC the best in world :)

@@Azrael i think it unreal. As i see, no chance   got global rating difficult for all site. Developers dismissed it idea, so all have personal opinions, and rating will very subjective, depends - like or unlike  a song and other. With low activity on voting with "star" it is fail idea. There was wishes like Achievements for profile participants, even this in near future not appear. I see post, where admin wrote that now low activity donations, and no money for more actual improve for site. (We ask about it 3-4 times, and nope.) Quality Championship depends only from us.

 

Im very sorry, for those who disagree with 4th class. But most participants want it.

 

I checked the new spreadsheet addition (Future SCL) -- I like the format although I am concerned about one part:

"This song will ignored, because have empty field in Diff. column."

 

I don't really feel qualified to assign a difficulty to lead / rhythm parts ... I can check and make sure that songs I select at least *have* a lead part (and ideally rhythm also), but any difficulty rating I assign to them is probably going to be way off.  Also, I wouldn't expect the guitar-only participants to be very accurate in their difficulty ratings of bass parts.  Requiring me to enter *something* for the difficulty in order to have my song considered would probably just encourage me to guess, which probably wouldn't produce very good results.

 

Maybe you could add another (wide) column after comments, and allow volunteers to suggest possible ratings for some arrangements of a song IF the person that added the song leaves a column blank.  I'd be happy to help give suggestions for about bass difficulty ratings if someone isn't sure, and I know I would appreciate the same king of assistance from guitar players if I select a song. 

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@@MilkmanDan I think enough one column for one rate, if you leaves it empty, volunteers can fill this field (or organizers). We need clear fields difficult, for correct sorting songs when begin select a song for WC. It and so it would be confusing doing in the start, there may be 3 song with equivalents rate on rhythm an example.

 

i understand if you fill rate for bass, and have empty field, your song cant be choiced.

There need new idea, i will think :)

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I put an example in the "Future SCL" tab of the list, and also put suggested difficulties into the older list, like:

 

Int (7) lots of shifting, string skip, tempo; tough int or easy MC - MMD

 

Too much text to fit in the column, but if anyone wants to read they can just click on the cell.  I tried to give a class, rating from 1-10, justification for my subjective rating, and a tag to let people know it was from me (-MMD).  If there was an additional column for that in the new tab, people could leave suggestions that the person who selected the song could either adapt or ignore at their discretion.  If anyone else had a different opinion, they could just append it on to the end of what anyone had already written, like:

 

Int (7) lots of shifting, string skip, tempo; tough int or easy MC - MMD   Beg (3) I disagree, I found it quite easy - SampleDude

 

 

 

Or if all that sounds too messy or whatever, I can adapt to the system as presented and just do my best to assign difficulties for all arrangements myself for any songs I select.  Not trying to make more work for anyone or to be a pain in the ass -- I just think that I would personally feel bad about drastically mis-classing suggested songs in terms of their lead/rhythm difficulty...

 

Hope that makes sense, and I'm not trying to step on any toes or anything.  Sorry if this comes across as bossy/whiny/whatever, I really don't mean it that way!  :)

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@@MilkmanDan I think enough one column for one rate, if you leaves it empty, volunteers can fill this field (or organizers). We need clear fields difficult, for correct sorting songs when begin select a song for WC. It and so it would be confusing doing in the start, there may be 3 song with equivalents rate on rhythm an example.

 

i understand if you fill rate for bass, and have empty field, your song cant be choiced.

There need new idea, i will think :)

 

That sounds good to me -- maybe put a ??? in the field for an arrangement we aren't sure about and something in the comment field saying suggestions are welcome?  Then volunteers can check and help out where needed, or if nobody helps out the person who selected the song can just make their best guess shortly before the next week's songs are chosen.

 

/approve

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Milkman Dan

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@@Hostilian Even if anyone miss week, his always can try choiced a song and filled difficult in SSL, and his a song will have same chance been choiced for WC. (it simple motivation for forced participants add a song what they really want play with all mark difficult, for quality wc). If participants miss week and don`t want describe his choice in SSL, he would have play a song for challenge choiced more active members. It seems honestly.

Besides we(volunteers) will test a songs, when find time, with empty diff. field and fill it. No much a songs stay are excluded from selection.

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I'm confused, how does being in the DieHard list effect the chances of your song being picked? Is it like a 75% chance that a song from a die hard member is chosen and 25% for everyone else?

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@@storm20200 Odds are much more similiar for DieHard'ers and Normal participants :) It was done to reward constant participating (so some of us would play song even if they don't like it).

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@@storm20200

1. Simple variant: Any a song picked random method from list, and accepted to challenge if have filled all field difficult.

2. More complicated variant: If song have any empty  field difficult, it will not accepted (until in future in not will filled). And will again drop dice for new random choice. But there is exclude for DieHard Men, for they songs, organizations can own check difficult and accept a song for challenge.

There 2 reasons why it will be. I hope all understand, that check all 4 a songs,  every a song have 3  paths, it requires a lot of time?  Second reason, it participants in honorable DHM list. Out of respect for their efforts we will to help with fill difficult to list in during selecting a song.

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OK that seems fair, I tell you what though I'm sick of people not putting proper sections in their songs. I was really looking forward to a week of The Clansman because it's really fun but I just tested the RR and it only has two sections on bass! I think I'll test all of my suggestions fully before putting them on the list so I don't keep wasting your time.

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