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Going Low: a Workaround to get Bass Notes below C1 to register in Rocksmith


Ross
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Today I found a workaround for getting the low bass notes such as low B to work with Rocksmith. I posted a scrappy test song in the database but they already pulled the plug on that, can't say I blame them :). But I got enough data for it to work as a proof of concept, you can see the discussions we had here. Me and a couple of people got a low B note, the thickest string on a 5-string bass to register in Rocksmith.

 

My theory was that the reason Rocksmith hits the wall at C1 is because after that you go into the zeroes, B0 is next. I thought it must be because Rocksmith doesn't like handling those zeroes in there. So could Rocksmith be tricked into thinking it is still in the 1st octave while in reality it's playing the notes that are of the 0th octave?

 

This brings us to the workaround. First off, you fiddle with the tuning in Editor of Fire. There you set the tuning to whatever is your desired tuning +6. (This is now pretty much obsolete, it's better to set it to +12, see the edits) In my test, I wanted the tuning to be in BEAD, the 4 lowest strings on a 5-string bass, so I set the tunings to 1,1,1,1. Because the B-string would be -5 compared to the standard 4-string E-string, I get -5+6=1, and so forth. Then you just chart the song as it is played in the desired tuning. If you have a chart like that already, just change the tuning accordingly and don't transpose the notes.

 

Next, in the Rocksmith toolkit you set the tuning for the arrangement the same as in eof, in this case 1,1,1,1. But here's the trick: you counter the +6 transpose you did in the tuning by setting the middle A as 311.2 Hz in the tuning pitch section. This causes all notes to be 6 semitones lower than normal.

 

Now, in my case the notes displayed for the strings are F1,A#1,D#2,G#2 but because of the different frequency reference the frequencies correspond to the notes B0,E1,A1,D2 in A440, or the pitch reference we normally use. As you can see, we have technically eliminated the 0th octave from the notes.

 

EDIT: I just realized you can probably do this in a more elegant manner. If you set your tuning to desired tuning +12 and offset that by setting the tuning pitch as 220 Hz you'll get the correct letters for the notes, they'll technically be an octave higher and octave lower at the same time if that makes sense :) The reason I went with +6 is because I first tried this pitch offset on the E standard tuning where you start off from 0 and are capped by the 11 semitone limit in EoF, but for B standard -5+12=7 if my math doesn't fail me here :P

 

Important: Make sure you're not using the same tuning in the toolkit for guitar and bass arrengements. We have already seem some snapped strings because the creator edited the "B standard" tuning in the toolkit to be 7,7,7,7 for bass and that also got applied to the guitar parts. You have to have two separate tunings, one normal for guitar and one with this trick for bass, you can look at LittleLui's post further down to see how he did this.

 

In game when you pick the song it shows the wrong note letters for the strings when you are tuning but they will tune to the correct desired note with the in game tuner (the game says the recording is "slightly" flat or sharp, just 6 semitones :P). Now if you've done everything correctly the chart should come out as it should be played in the desired tuning, and better yet, the game actually registers all of the notes. (EDIT: This bit is obsolete with the +-12 method, the notes should be the same. Though it will say it's in A220 tuning instead of A440)

 

I believe this should work the same for even lower tunings, if you wanna have an A string you just set the tuning on that to -1 (edit: 5 with the +-12 method), or a Bb string with the tuning set to 0 (edit: 6 with the +-12 method) for that particular string.

 

Some funny food for thought: the theoretical lowest note you could pull off with this is Gb0 I believe. Now, the maximum tuning you can set in eof is +11, and if you set the tuning pitch as 233.1, or 11 semitones below the standard middle A you could theoretically have rocksmith register a Db0 note, that is just over 17 Hz :P (actually, after what I realized, see the edit, the lowest you can go is theoretically C0 I think)

 

This will need some testing and fiddling around, obviously it's not an intended solution. Then again, the whole concept of cdlc's were not intended by the developer :)

 

EDIT: Here's a video of an actual cdlc by Rockfirstlast made with this trick, seems to be working perfectly. The tuning is C# Drop B

 

Link

 

Update: LittleLui has done a cdlc with BEAD tuning for bass with the +-12 method and it's working. The cldc is No Love Lost by Carcass if you wanna test it for yourself. He also made this comment in another post where he explains the trick in simple steps for already charted songs, might be useful to post it here:
 

 

...I gave this technique a try and it was both easy to apply and it worked, too. 

For existing songs its simply

  • change tuning in EOF by adding 12
  • deny the popup question suggesting auto-transposing
  • edit your custom tunings file for csct (additional bass tunings +12)
  • change the tuning of the bass part in csct to the +12 tunings, and the pitch to 220

 

where csct stands for the toolkit of course.

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This is from the song discussion:

 

Yep, you basically set the tuning in eof and the toolkit to the desired tuning +6, so for BEAD that is (1,1,1,1) (-5+6=1) and then counter that by setting the middle A to 311.2 Hz, or 600 cents lower than normal. This way rocksmith doesn't have to deal with the 0th octave.

 

Thanks again Ross, I just tried ADGC tuning with an offset of -799.89 (277.2Hz).  This worked out too.

 

I suppose an offset of -699.79 (293.7) would work for Bb Eb Ab Db

 

Looks like it's working with ADGC, and there are many ways to set the frequency offset for it to work.

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Very cool! It's great to see someone pushing the boundaries of bass in Rocksmith!

 

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but I don't have any experience with charting songs yet. After completing your steps above, do you still tune the bass to the desired tuning, or keep it in standard? At first I thought you would tune the bass, but after rereading your post, it almost sounds like you keep the bass in standard and the CDLC does the transposition down to the lower tuning for you.

 

Thanks,

 

 

sleepy

Acoustic Guitar:  Seagull Maritime GT  Playing Since:  8/11/2011

Electric Guitar:  Epiphone Les Paul Jr.  Playing since:  9/25/2013

Bass Guitar:  Squier Vintage Modified Jaguar Special  Playing Since:  2/17/2014

 

"The road of life is rocky, and you may stumble too. So while you point your finger, someone else is judging you." --Bob Marley

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This is amazing, thank you! 

 

By the way, my RocksmithToolkitLib.TuningDefinition.xml now has these additional sections for having B-Standard, Bb-Standard and Drop-B tunings for both guitar and bass:

  <TuningDefinition Version="RS2014" Name="BStandard" UIName="B Standard (custom)">    <Tuning string0="-5" string1="-5" string2="-5" string3="-5" string4="-5" string5="-5" />  </TuningDefinition>  <TuningDefinition Version="RS2014" Name="A#D#G#C#FA#" UIName="BbStandard (custom)">    <Tuning string0="-6" string1="-6" string2="-6" string3="-6" string4="-6" string5="-6" />  </TuningDefinition>  <TuningDefinition Version="RS2014" Name="BF#BEG#C#" UIName="DropB (custom)">    <Tuning string0="-5" string1="-3" string2="-3" string3="-3" string4="-3" string5="-3" />  </TuningDefinition>    <TuningDefinition Version="RS2014" Name="BStandard220" UIName="B Standard Bass (custom)" Custom="false">    <Tuning string0="7" string1="7" string2="7" string3="7" string4="7" string5="7" />  </TuningDefinition>  <TuningDefinition Version="RS2014" Name="A#D#G#C#FA#220" UIName="BbStandard Bass (custom)" Custom="false">    <Tuning string0="6" string1="6" string2="6" string3="6" string4="6" string5="6" />  </TuningDefinition>  <TuningDefinition Version="RS2014" Name="BF#BEG#C#220" UIName="DropB Bass (custom)" Custom="false">    <Tuning string0="7" string1="9" string2="9" string3="9" string4="9" string5="9" />  </TuningDefinition>
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Wow, this is amazing...thanks! As someone who only owns one bass, I'd say it's even worth doing for my CDLC that are in Eb standard so I don't have to constantly tune and re-tune for one or two odd songs in a session.

 

 

sleepy

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Acoustic Guitar:  Seagull Maritime GT  Playing Since:  8/11/2011

Electric Guitar:  Epiphone Les Paul Jr.  Playing since:  9/25/2013

Bass Guitar:  Squier Vintage Modified Jaguar Special  Playing Since:  2/17/2014

 

"The road of life is rocky, and you may stumble too. So while you point your finger, someone else is judging you." --Bob Marley

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Don't screw with songs that work fine... PLZ...

 

So happy that others have been working on this...

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1IL2zOTjhzm3gQCZ3_GR26ocW3ziEhg-2?usp=sharing__
Backup CDLC link ^^ - should list even the ones that got removed for inactive links...
just restored my ability to login again, so will try to slowly resubmit the missing ones...
and hoping to make a small come-back with some new CDLC ideas...
______________________________________________________________________________

YAMAHA 4-String 24 Frets - D Standard -> C Standard & D Drop C...

ASHTON - 4-String 21 Frets, E Standard, Drop D, Half-Step Down (Nirvana)...

Phoenix? - BASS 21-22 Frets? - 4-in-line Headstock...
(3 BASSES + 2 ELECTRIC G + 2 ACOUSTICS + a UKE)

Les Paul Special II - Guitar 

IBANEZ - USED MODIFIED MODEL...
After-market Tremolo Bridge + head-stock locking nut thingys --- Free 1994-ish Guitar =   🙂

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Don't screw with songs that work fine... PLZ...

Sorry, I should have clarified that I was referring to other people's CDLC that I've downloaded for my own use, not CDLC that I've created and shared. Because I haven't created any...yet.

 

 

sleepy

  • Like 1

Acoustic Guitar:  Seagull Maritime GT  Playing Since:  8/11/2011

Electric Guitar:  Epiphone Les Paul Jr.  Playing since:  9/25/2013

Bass Guitar:  Squier Vintage Modified Jaguar Special  Playing Since:  2/17/2014

 

"The road of life is rocky, and you may stumble too. So while you point your finger, someone else is judging you." --Bob Marley

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Wow, this is amazing...thanks! As someone who only owns one bass, I'd say it's even worth doing for my CDLC that are in Eb standard so I don't have to constantly tune and re-tune for one or two odd songs in a session.

 

 

sleepy

Either I'm misunderstanding you or you've misunderstood me. Songs in Eb standard have always worked, we are talking about songs that requite tunings below C. Is your bass a 4-string BEAD and you'd like to transpose songs in Eb to be played in BEAD?

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I'm probably misunderstanding you. I was under the impression that your process allowed me to keep my bass in standard EADG tuning, but that the modified CDLC would recognize the notes I play as if I had re-tuned to BEAD or another tuning. Based on that assumption, I made my post re: altering a given CDLC that was created in Eb standard so that I could leave my bass in E standard tuning but still have Rocksmith recognize the notes. Is this not correct?

 

I get the feeling I'm going to be wearing the noob hat for a while after this one...  :oops:

 

 

sleepy

Acoustic Guitar:  Seagull Maritime GT  Playing Since:  8/11/2011

Electric Guitar:  Epiphone Les Paul Jr.  Playing since:  9/25/2013

Bass Guitar:  Squier Vintage Modified Jaguar Special  Playing Since:  2/17/2014

 

"The road of life is rocky, and you may stumble too. So while you point your finger, someone else is judging you." --Bob Marley

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I'm just probably a bad writer, I get that every time I return an essay :P

 

Let me try to clarify it: let's take a song from In Flames, Deliver Us, as an example (cheers to Firekorn for doing In Flames cdlc's). In that song the bass is tuned to C drop Bb, that means the lowest string is tuned to Bb. Because normally Rocksmith doesn't allow you to tune bass below C you cannot make a correct cdlc for bass of that song, or if you do you cannot play it with a bass.

 

Now with this fix you can have a cdlc of that song where you can physically have your bass tuned to Bb and play it and have rocksmith register all the notes just like any other song. There is no "virtual" tuning or anything.

 

Before Rocksmith was basically incompatible with songs for 5-string basses because normally the lowest string on a 5-string bass is tuned to B or below (and B is just below C). Now with this it is possible and I hope people start making cdlc's for 5-strings, I have been thinking of getting one for myself :)

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Apparently these low bass tunings were working before for emulated bass with a guitar. I'd say this is because a guitar is naturally an octave higher than a bass and then the bass effect of dropping an octave is added virtually, kinda like what sleepy was thinking of maybe.

 

When you tune a guitar to an emulated B-standard bass tuning you only tune your guitar to B1 which is not a problem for Rocksmith, it's still a higher note than the E-string of a bass. Then the virtual bass effect is added. For an actual bass you'd have to tune to B0 which is not normally recognized by rocksmith because of the 0, see the first post.

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hmmm, just a crazy idea and probably really dumb but ....... would this principle work if it was done using the guitar part of a song? I wonder as then we could use five of the six strings on screen and tabbing the bass track over it, a sort of a reverse emulation if you like.

 

As said just a crazy thought as I'm thinking about getting a five string and would love to be able to use all the strings in the game.

 

So.... viable or not?

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Probably, at least it worth the try but you will have to replace a guitar part by a bass which could be pretty confusing if you aren't aware of this...

Firekorn's workshop
In Flames Discography

#FirekornHasDoneNothingForTheCommunity

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yes but in the toolkit when generating you can change the title of a part if i remember rightly, so tabbing as guitar then changing it when packaging maybe?? I dont think I have enough experience to get it right just yet but hopefully one of these intelleccy type minds on here might be able to work out my ponderings.

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hmmm, just a crazy idea and probably really dumb but ....... would this principle work if it was done using the guitar part of a song? I wonder as then we could use five of the six strings on screen and tabbing the bass track over it, a sort of a reverse emulation if you like.

 

As said just a crazy thought as I'm thinking about getting a five string and would love to be able to use all the strings in the game.

 

So.... viable or not?

I guess it should work, if you leave the tuning as +0 in eof and the toolkit and set the pitch as 220 Hz the guitar part should be in the bass register.

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The name in the toolkit define the part in RS so if you name it to bass, it will be a bass part, if you name it as a guitar it will be a guitar part.

 

As i understand what you want to try, is to use a guitar part which as 6 strings to play a bass part (simply using the tunning of a bass on 5 strings and for the sixth define something you can play for the tunning part). I don't see why it wouldn't work if Rocksmith accept to set a tunning this low for a guitar but it seems to accept almost everything so...

 

But if you create the bass part as bonus arrangement only people aware of this will use it.

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Firekorn's workshop
In Flames Discography

#FirekornHasDoneNothingForTheCommunity

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FOR these versions we need Them clearly marked as alternate versions...

Don't replace the main downloads...

this might not be the solution...

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1IL2zOTjhzm3gQCZ3_GR26ocW3ziEhg-2?usp=sharing__
Backup CDLC link ^^ - should list even the ones that got removed for inactive links...
just restored my ability to login again, so will try to slowly resubmit the missing ones...
and hoping to make a small come-back with some new CDLC ideas...
______________________________________________________________________________

YAMAHA 4-String 24 Frets - D Standard -> C Standard & D Drop C...

ASHTON - 4-String 21 Frets, E Standard, Drop D, Half-Step Down (Nirvana)...

Phoenix? - BASS 21-22 Frets? - 4-in-line Headstock...
(3 BASSES + 2 ELECTRIC G + 2 ACOUSTICS + a UKE)

Les Paul Special II - Guitar 

IBANEZ - USED MODIFIED MODEL...
After-market Tremolo Bridge + head-stock locking nut thingys --- Free 1994-ish Guitar =   🙂

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The name in the toolkit define the part in RS so if you name it to bass, it will be a bass part, if you name it as a guitar it will be a guitar part.

 

As i understand what you want to try, is to use a guitar part which as 6 strings to play a bass part (simply using the tunning of a bass on 5 strings and for the sixth define something you can play for the tunning part). I don't see why it wouldn't work if Rocksmith accept to set a tunning this low for a guitar but it seems to accept almost everything so...

 

But if you create the bass part as bonus arrangement only people aware of this will use it.

Yes, but we can increase awareness of BONUS Arrangements on this FORUM

and CAPS + BOLD HELPS on each RELEVANT C-DLC PAGE...

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1IL2zOTjhzm3gQCZ3_GR26ocW3ziEhg-2?usp=sharing__
Backup CDLC link ^^ - should list even the ones that got removed for inactive links...
just restored my ability to login again, so will try to slowly resubmit the missing ones...
and hoping to make a small come-back with some new CDLC ideas...
______________________________________________________________________________

YAMAHA 4-String 24 Frets - D Standard -> C Standard & D Drop C...

ASHTON - 4-String 21 Frets, E Standard, Drop D, Half-Step Down (Nirvana)...

Phoenix? - BASS 21-22 Frets? - 4-in-line Headstock...
(3 BASSES + 2 ELECTRIC G + 2 ACOUSTICS + a UKE)

Les Paul Special II - Guitar 

IBANEZ - USED MODIFIED MODEL...
After-market Tremolo Bridge + head-stock locking nut thingys --- Free 1994-ish Guitar =   🙂

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