Going Low: a Workaround to get Bass Notes below C1 to register in Rocksmith

[Ross]

Today I found a workaround for getting the low bass notes such as low B to work with Rocksmith. I posted a scrappy test song in the database but they already pulled the plug on that, can't say I blame them :). But I got enough data for it to work as a proof of concept, you can see the discussions we had here. Me and a couple of people got a low B note, the thickest string on a 5-string bass to register in Rocksmith.

 

My theory was that the reason Rocksmith hits the wall at C1 is because after that you go into the zeroes, B0 is next. I thought it must be because Rocksmith doesn't like handling those zeroes in there. So could Rocksmith be tricked into thinking it is still in the 1st octave while in reality it's playing the notes that are of the 0th octave?

 

This brings us to the workaround. First off, you fiddle with the tuning in Editor of Fire. There you set the tuning to whatever is your desired tuning +6. (This is now pretty much obsolete, it's better to set it to +12, see the edits) In my test, I wanted the tuning to be in BEAD, the 4 lowest strings on a 5-string bass, so I set the tunings to 1,1,1,1. Because the B-string would be -5 compared to the standard 4-string E-string, I get -5+6=1, and so forth. Then you just chart the song as it is played in the desired tuning. If you have a chart like that already, just change the tuning accordingly and don't transpose the notes.

 

Next, in the Rocksmith toolkit you set the tuning for the arrangement the same as in eof, in this case 1,1,1,1. But here's the trick: you counter the +6 transpose you did in the tuning by setting the middle A as 311.2 Hz in the tuning pitch section. This causes all notes to be 6 semitones lower than normal.

 

Now, in my case the notes displayed for the strings are F1,A#1,D#2,G#2 but because of the different frequency reference the frequencies correspond to the notes B0,E1,A1,D2 in A440, or the pitch reference we normally use. As you can see, we have technically eliminated the 0th octave from the notes.

 

EDIT: I just realized you can probably do this in a more elegant manner. If you set your tuning to desired tuning +12 and offset that by setting the tuning pitch as 220 Hz you'll get the correct letters for the notes, they'll technically be an octave higher and octave lower at the same time if that makes sense :) The reason I went with +6 is because I first tried this pitch offset on the E standard tuning where you start off from 0 and are capped by the 11 semitone limit in EoF, but for B standard -5+12=7 if my math doesn't fail me here :P

 

Important: Make sure you're not using the same tuning in the toolkit for guitar and bass arrengements. We have already seem some snapped strings because the creator edited the "B standard" tuning in the toolkit to be 7,7,7,7 for bass and that also got applied to the guitar parts. You have to have two separate tunings, one normal for guitar and one with this trick for bass, you can look at LittleLui's post further down to see how he did this.

 

In game when you pick the song it shows the wrong note letters for the strings when you are tuning but they will tune to the correct desired note with the in game tuner (the game says the recording is "slightly" flat or sharp, just 6 semitones :P). Now if you've done everything correctly the chart should come out as it should be played in the desired tuning, and better yet, the game actually registers all of the notes. (EDIT: This bit is obsolete with the +-12 method, the notes should be the same. Though it will say it's in A220 tuning instead of A440)

 

I believe this should work the same for even lower tunings, if you wanna have an A string you just set the tuning on that to -1 (edit: 5 with the +-12 method), or a Bb string with the tuning set to 0 (edit: 6 with the +-12 method) for that particular string.

 

Some funny food for thought: the theoretical lowest note you could pull off with this is Gb0 I believe. Now, the maximum tuning you can set in eof is +11, and if you set the tuning pitch as 233.1, or 11 semitones below the standard middle A you could theoretically have rocksmith register a Db0 note, that is just over 17 Hz :P (actually, after what I realized, see the edit, the lowest you can go is theoretically C0 I think)

 

This will need some testing and fiddling around, obviously it's not an intended solution. Then again, the whole concept of cdlc's were not intended by the developer :)

 

EDIT: Here's a video of an actual cdlc by Rockfirstlast made with this trick, seems to be working perfectly. The tuning is C# Drop B

 

Link

 

Update: LittleLui has done a cdlc with BEAD tuning for bass with the +-12 method and it's working. The cldc is No Love Lost by Carcass if you wanna test it for yourself. He also made this comment in another post where he explains the trick in simple steps for already charted songs, might be useful to post it here:
 

 

...I gave this technique a try and it was both easy to apply and it worked, too. 

For existing songs its simply

• change tuning in EOF by adding 12
• deny the popup question suggesting auto-transposing
• edit your custom tunings file for csct (additional bass tunings +12)
• change the tuning of the bass part in csct to the +12 tunings, and the pitch to 220

 

where csct stands for the toolkit of course.

[Rockfirstlast]

@@Ross : You can compared to the bass part for the note, it's exactly the same only on 4 strings

 

By the way, i'm not really used to the standard 5 strings bass tunning is there anything special here or the way it is actually done in Land of Confusion is ok?

 

The note detection for Land of Confusion was ok.  I didn't miss any notes.  But the song was charted wrong.  It sounded like everything was a fifth higher than it should have been.  Lemme play it again and see exactly what it was.

[Ross]

Oh I didn't realize the tuning goes from the highest string to lowest instead of the other way like on the bass part. My bad.

[Rockfirstlast]

Just listened to Land of Confusion again.

 

If you were to raise all the yellow notes up two frets and then push everything down a string the tab makes sense.  I'm guessing this problem happened because the tab used a different tuning.

 

The only exception is the last 20 seconds of the song, which would need a little bit of work.

[firekorn]

Yeah, i was thinking about this, only doing a half step down tunning would work and make more sense than the actual tunning used in the tab.

 

I will change everything tonight and repost a new version to see if it make more sense.

About the last 20 seconds, i will try to sort it out but it's not link to the test but only to the song and the tab that i have...

 

I will try to do a proper tutorial here with some information about which tunning to choose etc. during the weekend.

[dave]

picking this up tomorrow

looking forward to some experimentation.

[firekorn]

here is a new version of Land of confusion with a more standard tunning (one half step down from a 5 strings bass standard tunning)

http://www.mediafire.com/download/revwcuccrd37dh7

[dave]

will be trying this tomorrow.

[Rockfirstlast]

here is a new version of Land of confusion with a more standard tunning (one half step down from a 5 strings bass standard tunning)

http://www.mediafire.com/download/revwcuccrd37dh7

 

Just played it.  Sounds good!

[dave]

yep played it note recognition works but needs some volume.

[dave]

the 5 string bonus track would appear to be a complete success, 94% on my first play through (my misses not RS)

Huge grin on my face just now.

do we have any others other than land of confusion at the moment.

 

 

Oh and still cant tune to disturbed..... the prayer ??? 

[firekorn]

Well it was a first experience for the 5 strings bass. I will try to keep doing it when i have all the needed material that allow me to do it but for other charter to do it, you might need to spread the word around and hope them to do it.

 

And i will write a tutorial for the 5 strings bass and for the recognition workaround so that it's easier for people to implement it.

[dave]

would greatly appreciate a tutorial. just mentioned it in the chat and a couple of people are buzzing mate.

[firekorn]

Tutorial available, don't know if it's very clear but it's a start :

http://customsforge.com/topic/5227-5-strings-bass-and-low-note-recognition/

[dave]

thanks.

[dave]

a video playthrough of firekorns 5 string track

[TheBestAlex]

I'm just probably a bad writer, I get that every time I return an essay :P

 

Let me try to clarify it: let's take a song from In Flames, Deliver Us, as an example (cheers to Firekorn for doing In Flames cdlc's). In that song the bass is tuned to C drop Bb, that means the lowest string is tuned to Bb. Because normally Rocksmith doesn't allow you to tune bass below C you cannot make a correct cdlc for bass of that song, or if you do you cannot play it with a bass.

 

Now with this fix you can have a cdlc of that song where you can physically have your bass tuned to Bb and play it and have rocksmith register all the notes just like any other song. There is no "virtual" tuning or anything.

 

Before Rocksmith was basically incompatible with songs for 5-string basses because normally the lowest string on a 5-string bass is tuned to B or below (and B is just below C). Now with this it is possible and I hope people start making cdlc's for 5-strings, I have been thinking of getting one for myself :)

Well, it'd still have to be a song that only uses 4-strings no matter how you stack it. Just now you can use B E A D. Probably will be a little tricky picking out songs that don't play anything on the G. Also, for me atleast, trying to "read" a rocksmith chart to be played on a 5-string instead of standard 4-string would be tricky, as instead of playing the 4-strings and reading the game the way I always have, now I'd be up 1-string, reading the colors completely different than I always have. If this makes any sense at all, lmfao.

[TheBestAlex]

Okay, nevermind.... I should read and look at everything. It just gets tedious in these forums. So you can chart 5-strings for bass and have them appear!!!! This is awesome now I just have to read more and figure out how, lol.

[TheBestAlex]

I still see a problem though. 5-string songs, versus every other 4-string song in existence is going to be read differently. I have a feeling this could be sorta tricky to adapt to, going back and forth. Now I want every song to be re-written in different colors.

[dave]

Ive actually charted a song using five string tabs and played it on my five string bass, I can see the notes to play as if i was playing a guitar but hearing and registering the bass notes correctly, the 220 thing works it just takes a bit of playing around in the charting and creation stage. 

[Ross]

Well, some people play both the guitar and bass, I think it's more of a thing to adapt between a guitar and a bass than a 5 string and a 4 string.

[dave]

I still see a problem though. 5-string songs, versus every other 4-string song in existence is going to be read differently. I have a feeling this could be sorta tricky to adapt to, going back and forth. Now I want every song to be re-written in different colors.

i dont understand where you see the problem.... think of it as playing a guitar track but you'll never have to hit the high e string.

 

Everything looks just the same as playing a guitar track, except the 5 string (or possibly six string) will be charted as a bonus guitar track.

 

the only difficulty (not thats it difficult) is the tuning page where you need to play a few frets up the g string to trick RS into believing there are six strings.

[TheBestAlex]

Okay let me try to explain better what I mean. I play on a 5-string bass. Up until now I've obviously only used the standard 4-strings. So here's the way I read the game (E-Red, A-Yellow, D-Blue, G-Orange). So now I go to play a 5-string bass chart and everything is set up differently (B-Red, E-Yellow, A-Blue, D-Orange, G-Green). While in theory it sounds quite simple, each color will now just be up one string, BUT I've become so used to the old way that I think adapting to the new colors will take a while. PLUS now when I go back to a 4-string chart I have to re-associate the colors again. I know this probably seems like a little problem, but I think it's sorta a nightmare.

[TheBestAlex]

Well, some people play both the guitar and bass, I think it's more of a thing to adapt between a guitar and a bass than a 5 string and a 4 string.

That top string is always red between a guitar and a 4-string bass though. For me switching between a 4-string chart and a 5-string chart, playing my 5-string bass, the colors will be associated to different string each time.

[Ross]

 

Well, some people play both the guitar and bass, I think it's more of a thing to adapt between a guitar and a bass than a 5 string and a 4 string.

That top string is always red between a guitar and a 4-string bass though. For me switching between a 4-string chart and a 5-string chart, playing my 5-string bass, the colors will be associated to different string each time.

 

I'm not the most knowledgeable on guitars, but aren't some songs tuned B standard where the strings are B-E-A-D and so forth on guitar too.

[TheBestAlex]

 

 

Well, some people play both the guitar and bass, I think it's more of a thing to adapt between a guitar and a bass than a 5 string and a 4 string.

That top string is always red between a guitar and a 4-string bass though. For me switching between a 4-string chart and a 5-string chart, playing my 5-string bass, the colors will be associated to different string each time.

 

I'm not the most knowledgeable on guitars, but aren't some songs tuned B standard where the strings are B-E-A-D and so forth on guitar too.

 

I have a 5-string bass, now I am only using 4 strings on my 5-string (not using the B-string). The tuning can be changed to anything and I will still be reading the colors associated to the strings the same (just as a guitar player tuned to B-E-A-D instead of E-A-D-G). NOW I go to play a 5-string bass chart and NOW the B-string is in the mix (this is my top string). Now this means the colors aren't associated the same anymore. It has nothing to do with tuning but with number of strings.